Daily Kos members think they are the Center
No offense to Daily Kos but they in general are not in the political Center. Having polls showing you are in the majority or even large supermajority on some issues does not automatically equate to being in the political Center.
I understand the desire to move the Overton Window, in which case constantly trying to spread the case of being "centrist" is not bad as long as you are aware that you are spreading propaganda. Regular, useful propaganda but propaganda nonetheless.
Read on...
Being in the political Center on the other hand is not the same as being in the Mainstream of the political thought. Majorities on both Right and Left are in the Mainstream which to me technically means adhering to acceptably (by majority of the American public and Elected Reps) non-radical views that are within range of our American political sphere.
The various dkos ideological polls show that 90%+ of them are Liberals/Progressives. Why is that not Centrist you might ask (though plenty of you know you are not) if majorities of Americans agree with you on important issues? It is all about where your emphasis and priorities are. If your emphasis is on fighting for helping the poor, corporate social responsibility, healthcare as a right for all, greater social acceptance of minorities, gays, etc, and you have a great personal interest in seeing our country move in that direction, you are on the Left ideologically regardless of how much of the country generally agrees with you. US Left that is since US is very different politically from the rest of the World.
Some of them say that the country has moved too far to the Right in the last few decades which in turn abandoned you "formerly moderate" and made you look like the Left. In what sense has that happened? On the Social front moving towards greater equality and acceptance of women, minorities, and homosexuals in most areas has made great strides in the last few decades. Social Conservatives have been losing clout and have almost nothing to point to as achievements while the Left can show many States moving towards greater tolerance. On the Economic front the government never stopped growing in both discretionary and entitlement areas which only accelerated under Bush. It is true that we do not have Universal HealthCare but we never had that so no one can claim we moved to the Right on that.
Oh, but they want to redefine the Center to fit what the majority of them believes to swing the pendulum back? It's a nice thought but the reality is that the core of their ideology is still of the Left (nothing wrong with that) and even if the country will swing further towards their preferences it would be a farce to call the Left's ideology centrist no matter how much in ascendancy it would be. Same for the Right.
What makes someone Centrist is not the fact that the person does not prefer any Liberal or Conservative views but that the person has at least some of the following:
- A healthy mix of the views from both Right and Left
- Absense of zeal towards moving the country into a particular ideological direction
- Your priorities and emphasis are simply not on changing the ideological status quo in a great way
- You do not think that your side's views are good and the other side's views are evil
- A desire to listen to solutions to problems without initially having preconcieved notions on the best ideologically correct solution
- Dislike for extremes of either of the main existing ideologies
I think it is ok to try to sell the American public on your being mainstream, centrist, moderate, or whatever else they want the American Public to believe as long as you do not kid yourself. What's wrong with being on the Left anyways?
- Ender's blog
- Login or register to post comments
Comments :
Good effort
But in reading through the over 100 comments on dKos so far, I only found a handful that got your point.
I'm interested in hearing what our liberals have to say.
thanks
also an intelligent republican chimed in at the bottom of all those comments.
"To discuss evil in a manner implying neutrality, is to sanction it." AR
I do have to add
That I think your ideological definitions of what being "centrist" is are spot on, but, speaking as one, quite frankly it's a hellish place to be sometimes.
I reccomended it,
Good discussion to have.
I can't believe some jerk troll rated the diary.
You should edit your diary and remove it.
thanks man
changed it. That discussion was not well suited for dkos :)
"To discuss evil in a manner implying neutrality, is to sanction it." AR
As for Ender's definitions of Centrist,
I agree somewhat with the more abstract definitions in the bullet points, but I do disagree that specific stances are necessarily tied to pendulum swings, and can therefore be called inherently left/right/center. Some issues do seem to swing back and forth: the pro-choice population is no longer as strong as it was when Roe first passed, so that's a fair point that it's "left". But some issues die with time: to use an extreme example (sorry), I don't think being anti-slavery puts people on the left anymore.
But it's a good stab, and the comments at dkos were a hoot.
Saint, n. A dead sinner revised and edited. - Ambrose Bierce
You are defining centrist
as essentially a third party or ideological poisition rather than associating it with the mean (or median or mode) of public sentiment (which you seem to be calling "moderate"). I think that's probably a fine way to define the terms, by which I mean I think you can make valuable observations using those definition, but it wouldn't seem to be in line with how most people use the term. Which means you'll have to be very clear on when you are using your particular meanings versus the vulgar (common) meanings.
For instance according to your view a person could be centrist and yet extremist (i.e. not moderate). In fact hardcore libertarians would be exactly such an example.
Anyway I'm not sure your point choice of definitions here do much to support your argument since the DKos crowd are almost certainly arguing from a position where centrist and moderate are more closely connected if not identical. That is, that if you were to find a mode average of political opinion that some width of distribution around that mode would be considered moderate (maybe 1 standard dveiation for example). If that mode is far to "the left" then that distribution may well include the majority of DKos who are then "moderates" or "centrists." (It should go without saying that you cannot, of course, do any such mathematical operation on such qualities as political opinion)
I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.
When did DailyKos claim to be the center?
Was there a diary that I missed that this diary is responding to?
skymutt: accept no substitutes!
You should link
the reference to the 'Overton Window' to the diary we have here for more exposure of our site.
Just an idea and it may be too late to matter.
We are all mediators, translators. - Derrida
LOL i see otto showed up in the comments....
..to harrass Ender a little bit... I recall that otto went so far as to create a SwordsCrossed account so that he could continue to assail a previous Ender diary over here...
skymutt: accept no substitutes!
Bob Johnson is there too
Haven't seen him around here recently...
Come, my friends. 'Tis not too late to seek a newer world -- Tennyson
ahhh that's who he is
no wonder... What a bastard.
"To discuss evil in a manner implying neutrality, is to sanction it." AR
SC is in
the Dkos random blog list for today (at the top to boot).
Everyone run a clean ship today so as not to embarrass us (GoRight).
98.732% joking. :-)
We are all mediators, translators. - Derrida
Too bad the link
is to the old soapblox frontpage, now nonexistent. Hopefully the hordes of kossites eager to discover SC will click through to the lively discussions we're having.
Come, my friends. 'Tis not too late to seek a newer world -- Tennyson
Let us know if it's reflected in the stats (nt)
Just going off the sitemeter
linked on the frontpage here, I don't see anyone recently coming from dailykos.com itself. There are a few coming over from Ender's diary. Traffic is pretty normal, actually.
Guess we'll have to buy an ad on their frontpage to really start hauling in the new readers =) Or at Redstate, that place has ads *everywhere* now, it's annoying to even read.
Come, my friends. 'Tis not too late to seek a newer world -- Tennyson
oh sh*t...
I'll have to refrain from any
dildocomments, huh?Sh*t! Did it again.
I survived the Bush Administration
RE: SC is in
I'm going to keep pointing out your foibles as I see them. If that embarrasses you, well, then don't make the foibles.
I'm the Bugs Bunny of Swords Crossed!
-4 Strongly Disagree - 0 Meh - Strongly Agree +4Speaking of foibles.....
How many times have you been banned at dKos now? A source of pride for you I presume. :)
Ha!
I'm only half stupid
Countless.
Actually, it is! And I really mean that.
I'm the Bugs Bunny of Swords Crossed!
-4 Strongly Disagree - 0 Meh - Strongly Agree +4Can I have a list of your banned accunts?
It would be entertaining late-night viewing to see the various ways that you've gone down in flames...
skymutt2 [at] gmail.com if you're willing to share but don't want to publish it...
skymutt: accept no substitutes!
you a tu again?
If so can you lookup some of my last hidden comments?
"To discuss evil in a manner implying neutrality, is to sanction it." AR
sent em to you in an email n/t
skymutt: accept no substitutes!
Sure, I guess it doesn't matter at this point.
I don't know them all because in the middle I wasn't keeping track of them after they were banned. They were all throw away accounts. I would just pre-register accounts 1 a day and have a week I always had an account that was allowed to post diaries. It only took a few minutes to setup a new account so the overhead was low. Here is where is all started:
The following account may have been mine but they may not have any comments. Before I realized that they were using cookies to correlate the sock puppets they would be able to nuke all of my accounts at once if they wanted to. I later thwarted that. :) Since I can't see if these have any comments I don't know if they are interesting or not. Note the patterns of the names on the keyboard to make them easier to remember. I eventually had to abandon this because I thought it was too predictable.
There are maybe 20 or so accounts that I have no idea about any longer since I didn't track them after they were defunct. I then discovered that I would want to refer to an old comment but I couldn't find it because I couldn't remember the account anymore. So then I started keeping a record of the old accounts. Here are some of those which are most recent:
Some of those accounts may have been killed before they had a chance to post anything. I can't tell either way.
That's a pretty representative set. As I said and have made perfectly clear I am no longer trolling there, I don't even want to go there except to look at my own stuff!
I'm the Bugs Bunny of Swords Crossed!
-4 Strongly Disagree - 0 Meh - Strongly Agree +4Sheesh
That is an unbelievable amount of effort to do whatever it was you thought you were doing.
Every account I clicked on showed thenumber of comments as zero. All that is left is the ghost names of your old troll hunting dairies.
It appears all of your brilliant comments have been zapped.
I'm only half stupid
hmmm
did you click on the search archive button? :)
"To discuss evil in a manner implying neutrality, is to sanction it." AR
LOL Not until you said to.
I thought comments just appeared automatically.
Thanks!
As you can see I am not too savvy in this area....!
Ack. Now I will have to read a few of the comments.
I'm only half stupid
Your debate style is easily recognizable
(now that Ender showed me how to access the comments)
I'm only half stupid
Yep.
The truth is always recognizable to those who seek it! :)
I'm the Bugs Bunny of Swords Crossed!
-4 Strongly Disagree - 0 Meh - Strongly Agree +4The truth
can be subjective.
Case in point. See above statement :)
I'm only half stupid
Ah the memories.
I was just reading through LibGrrl a bit. Great stuff, man. Great stuff.
Irishwitch was always fun to poke. Man you could get her so riled up it was hilarious. Sort of like you, missliberties, but she had two main hot buttons: abortion and Christians. They were always good for drawing her out.
You've got a more broad range of things to poke but none of them are as deep. Although I remember a few times when you could spit nails too! :)
I'm the Bugs Bunny of Swords Crossed!
-4 Strongly Disagree - 0 Meh - Strongly Agree +4such a rush showing out liberals to be hypocrits isn't it
Spending four hours coming to agreement on the meaning of irrelevant, is an excerise in goright's illogical formulations, at the expense of enjoying an otherwise beautiful day.
So your goal is not to debate but to poke fun at, as in mock.
At least that is an intellectually honest statement. Perhaps your first. :)
I'm only half stupid
Not much of a rush, actually ...
because it is trivially easy to do. Basically you read one comment, wait ten minutes, and then read another comment by the same liberal poster and there is a better than 50/50 chance that you have something to point out. :P
I view it more as a civic obligation, actually. My community service if you will. I'm a giver like that, always looking for ways to help others.
I'm the Bugs Bunny of Swords Crossed!
-4 Strongly Disagree - 0 Meh - Strongly Agree +4You missed it
the subtle refererance to me nailing your on the word irrelevant and Rush Limbaugh.
Which led to your, "It's ever so pointless to post here" dairy.
I'm only half stupid
Here's where I met Ender! :)
http://www.dailykos.com/comments/2006/11/9/21632/0097/27#c27
I'm the Bugs Bunny of Swords Crossed!
-4 Strongly Disagree - 0 Meh - Strongly Agree +4yeah
I found it too - still remember those days after the election :)
"To discuss evil in a manner implying neutrality, is to sanction it." AR
Heh, that's actually a really good diary
Well-written...
skymutt: accept no substitutes!
XYZZY
A hallow voice says "Plugh"
Ah the heady pre-Zork days of Apple Adventure.
Zork!
I spent hours and hours and hours (and lots of sleepless nights) playing that, on the 6 x 6 screen on the hundred pounds of hardware that used to pass for a portable computer.
I still have my room maps. W is the Control Room. . . .
Zork is like real life
Heck, Lord Dimwit Flathead has been elected president twice!
"I am the boss of you!" (nt)
More on Zork
Check it out
You know you wanna.
For the children
I feel compelled to link to a bit of history just so they can see where PC gaming began, way back in the distant murky DOS past.
Click it and see.
Zork was the last PC game I stayed up all night for, before SL. Probably had something to do with the fact that I was having to borrow the PC from work on the weekends to play it, but still.
We have a winner!
Although I never played adventure on the Apple. It was on various other university systems as well. Man, those were the days, eh? Life was good back then.
I'm the Bugs Bunny of Swords Crossed!
-4 Strongly Disagree - 0 Meh - Strongly Agree +4Hey, if you find any good ones
cross post them over here for me. I like to reminisce about my glory days at dkos sometimes!
I'm the Bugs Bunny of Swords Crossed!
-4 Strongly Disagree - 0 Meh - Strongly Agree +4Hehe
It's pretty funny stuff from the bits that I've looked at so far... it seems that most everyone gets some enjoyment out of the trolling/troll vanquishing process... and I have to admit that some hilarious pictures
get posted in the hidden comments...
LibGrrl actually made some valid points in the religion discussion that I agreed with. The intent to provoke flames was still there, mind you... but a significant number of DK users are intolerant of religion, and can fairly be called hostile to Christians.
This post
I would immediately identify as you. Nobody else ever just spontaneously breaks out this kind of logic, especially after some heat has been generated in the discussion.
This brings up a point that DK, as big a site as it is, and as important a site as it is, does not have as many "users" as you sometimes see claimed. Somewhere around 120,000 user accounts are in the system, but most of those accounts are dead or forgotten accounts that will never be used again. If you ever see jotter's stats, it becomes clear that DK really just has a few thousand active participants, and several thousand more occasional participants.
As someone who runs a website/community with far fewer user accounts (around 15,000), I can report the same effect on my site... only about a thousand people are frequent users of the site, and only about 3,000 of the accounts are even occasional users. The large majority of the accounts appear to be dead, forgotten accounts. My theory is that if you have a site on the internet where you can sign up for a free account, if you can get 5-10% of your actual signups back to your site on a regular basis, you're doing good.
skymutt: accept no substitutes!
LOL
Spontaneous logic is my trademark, eh? Well I can live with that. He he.
Yes, I have long conjectured that I mayself make up a not totally insignifcant number of the DKOS accounts. I was a frequent visiter as you can see, but the stats would never show that. I know for a fact that I am not the only one to ever troll over there, either. So between the trolls a significant portion of the total accounts are actually trolls.
Kos isn't stupid though. He leaves the accounts around so that he can claim a larger community for advertising purposes. I realize that I am helping him in that respect by creating the sock puppets but it is obviously a trade-off I was, key point was, willing to make.
Now you all get to enjoy my pearls of wisdom! :)
I'm the Bugs Bunny of Swords Crossed!
-4 Strongly Disagree - 0 Meh - Strongly Agree +4The Center
Well as described in your dairy it *depends* on what you mean by center.
You mean the soft gooey center where everyone is content and things are flowing smoothly, folks have jobs and are generally happy with the status quo.
The center is a place, imho, where no dramatic changes come from.
I would suggest that the folks in this country are generally 'center', wanting to raise a family have a job and have the government work for them and not against them. They want the post office to work and the potholes in the roads to be filled.
I do believe ideologically there has been a concerted push, to move the country to the hard right, and then to the right even more, thereby making people that were previously in the center seem left.
There IS an ideological mindset by a few on the right to dramatically change the way our country functions and the current president and his entourage are the head of the movement.
I will never forget the speech GWB gave after the '04 'election' whence he stated he had earned political capital (50% +1) and he was going to use it to accomplish his *agenda*. Even my *centrist* brother who voted for Bush was disturbed by that statement.
That this country has had many historic firsts under this President is no coincidence, the most glaring being a pre-emptive invasion of a country that didn't attack us. Bringing the whole of Congress back in session to save the life of one brain dead woman, Terri Schiavo another historic first. The suspension of habeous, and vacuum style wire tapping program. These all represent an extreme, imho.
You can paint dKos as not being centrist, but it is difficult to pin down with a broadbrush because there are so many posters from so many different perspectives. I mean you are there aren't you.
The hard right has brought radical changes to our country's leadership philosophy and business models and methods.
So dKos is not the gooey center, it is the activist center. They are a group of opinionated folks that see the (detrimental) changes in our country and are trying to counteract those changes. To do so might take a swing to the left to counter balance the swing that's been made to the hard right.
Why is it so left wing to want government to function? Why is it left wing to want leaders to operate openly and trasnparently. Why is it left wing to want habeous corpus to remain a founding principle of this country. Why is it left wing to want pension contracts to be honored and not turned over to the tax payer. It isn't.
IN order to put dKos in perspective you have to look at the other side, or the leadership and direction of this country that has taken a hard right turn. It is less about party anymore than it is about an ideology.
It is important to remember that dKos was a place where people who read things other than what the media was spoon feeding the public went to say, OMG, why are they ignoring the facts and diverting us into Iraq. There were plenty of facts that said Bush's claims against Iraq were untrue, yet John Q Public was swallowing the media propaganda whole. The folks at dKos were the ones with regular common sense who gathered as a community to say no that is NOT true, this is wrong in every way. IN that sense the rest of the country, the center' has moved to the common sense position that dKos held in the first place. There was no good reason to pre-emptively invade Iraq. It would be a mistake of historical proportions, and the predictions of the kossacks, six years later have all turned out to be true.
I'm only half stupid
Well said.
I always have thought Dkos, netroots are the informed public and if the public has the same information that DK readers or netroots have--they will be of the same mind.
True enough once the public realized there were no WMD and Iraq had nothing to do with 911 they soured on the Iraq War.
Of course there are diverse opinion in Dk, and I remember you said DK is whatever you want it to be.
I think people like me selective read--read those I agree.
Markos Moulitsas vs Harold Ford Jr.
The DLC vs DailyKos
This Sunday on Meet the Press.
If you are a political junky who thinks that the DLC has moved right, and that DailyKos is closer to the pulse of the people, you might enjoy this Sunday's show.
And thanks Jasmine.
I'm only half stupid
Harold Ford
is infinitely cooler than Markos.
"To discuss evil in a manner implying neutrality, is to sanction it." AR
It should be an interesting exchange.
Ford may be infinitely cooler, but Markos is infinitely smarter.
I'm only half stupid
I really don't think so
Ford is a very smart guy and Markos is not exactly a genius (though smart of course).
"To discuss evil in a manner implying neutrality, is to sanction it." AR
One thing I've always said about Markos....
Once you take his vehement partisanship out of the picture and just look at his views, he's well to the "Libertarian Right" compared to his thousands of posters who use his site as an outlet for political expression.
I find that ironic of the founder of the Activist Left's premier site.
Markos was an Moderate "HW BUSH" Republican turned Democrat around the time of the W Bush's foreign escapades.
I think that says something about the GOP over the past 7 years as well as its effect on Democrats and moderates....as well as Kossacks.
This should be a good test
what is the best way to move the country..... being *centrist* or being a partisan progressive.
I vote for partisan progressive.
These days *centrist* democrats are needing to make too many apologies and excuses for not standing up for the tenets of the constitution and not upholding the rightful position of Congress to be a check on executive power.
I'm only half stupid
Harold Ford is the kind of guy...
...that make me wonder if the aliens haven't already infiltrated our midst... there's something not quite human about that guy, and I can't quite put my finger on it. I'm not convinced that he is a warm-blooded organism.
skymutt: accept no substitutes!
When the Hard Right Supports the DLC *Centrists*
Will Democrats Abandon the Middle
Yet another example of the fake centerist DLC being supported by the likes of the editorialists of the WSJ.
Kimberly Strassel well known editorialist for the Wall Street Journal promotes the *centrist* DLC, singing priases for Al From and Harold Ford, asking the pressing question, why the democrats have abandoned the center. The more pressing questions is why Republicans have abandoned the center and taken a right angle turn.
Ms. Strassel singing the praises of Harold Ford and Al From, the 'centrist' engineering master of the Democrats defeat in '04. No thanks Kimberly. You
are misreading the tea leaves.
The DLC is a dinosaur, no longer relevant, whose time has come and gone.
I'm only half stupid
Markos & Susan G op-ed in Washington Post
..in response to the Harold Ford op-ed:
How we won the mainstream
Markos is claiming the center again-- Ender will not be pleased!
skymutt: accept no substitutes!
Ha!
Has the netroots nation arrived?
I would like to see the center reclaimed and then move a little to the left.
I have to say that there are 41 Democrats I am pretty damn disappointed in, the ones that voted to amend the FISA law. I think we should send them all a copy of the constitution, with certain sections highlighted.
What is so crazy and disturbing to me, is that President & Team have taken more and more and more power into the exectuvie branch and folks just seem to be yawning.
Harriet Miers should be required to testify before Congress, as was John Dean who held her same position under Nixon.
And when Susan Taylor reluctantly testified before Congress, she said she took an oath to uphold the President not the Constitution.
Repeat: Susan Taylor raised her hand and swore to uphold the President not the Constitution. Oh snap!
This is ludicrous. La de da everything is normal.......yawn. America goes shopping while the constitution is being shredded.
And folks are whining that the country has gone to far to the left!!! How about just getting BACK to the center.
I'm only half stupid
I only wish that the netroots nation had 'arrived'
...With something a little less boastful, petty, and backward looking.
I mean seriously-- here's Markos, bragging about his victories over the DLC, an organization that lost its shine when Clinton decided that it was more important to get his knob polished than pass on a legacy of Democratic rule. The 'our party was cooler than theirs' stuff takes me back to high school. And the obligatory rehash of the Lieberman/Lamont primary; funny that Lieberman is still in the Senate-- how did that happen? Oh yeah, I remember now-- Lamont was a stiff and a dud.
Yes, Markos had a golden opportunity to advance important causes and instead decided to focus on past 'glories'. Meanwhile, Rome is burning.
skymutt: accept no substitutes!
Is he bragging?
Or just noticing that not one single Presidential candidate went to the DLC's leadership council meeting? Why because the DLC is irrelevant? Why because they have been hijacked and infilitrated by centrists (and apparently the right)who think it is just hunky dory to keep the status quo status quo.
Wasn't he just responding to Ford's op-ed?
IMHO the jury is undecided on who you could consider more arrogant, the DLC or Markos. At this time I submit that the once arrogant, elitist DLC gasbags like Al From, have had the air taken out of their slavishly bland and pandering to the corporatist bought and paid for fake centerist ways. I think that is a good thing.
I'm only half stupid
Hell yeah the DLC guys are arrogant
And now, the netroots is arrogant also, they have a near-perfect environment of conservative failures in which to grow a real productive movement, and they are squandering it by focusing on petty political rivalries. Everybody is so intent on carving out their own little fiefdom, and nothing gets accomplished. The netroots is not attracting people, it is driving people like me away.
Markos points to Howard Dean. Well, Howard Dean was the high point of the netroots movement. I don't see any Howard Deans in the 2008 race, do you? How is that a positive step for the netroots? Now they've hitched their wagons to John Edwards who I see as a pandering populist who is running what I consider to be a class warfare campaign that appeals to the worst tendencies of the left wing.
Sorry to rant, but I'm just tired of the lack of humility, the lack of civility, and the lack of progress.
skymutt: accept no substitutes!
Well at least you changed
your bar from red to black.
You are looking for a savior? I do think the country is thirsty for a leader with vision.
Well poor Howard D. just got screwed by 41 Blue Dog dems who choked of his fundraising capability.
They haven't all hitched their wagon to Johnny 'pretty boy Edwards'. Kos trashed him hard the more he thought about the stupidity of using campaign funds for haircuts. ON a personal note..... I just don't think he is sincere. But his wife is great! Love her.
I agree the lack of progress is frustrating. But don't give up on the 180 or more good dems. That would be throwing the baby out with the bath water.
As for Republicans that say the war sucks, then waffle when the vote....... they are nowhere's ville.
I'm only half stupid
Probably a large part of my bad political mood
...Has to do with the fact that I've had to give up on Bill Richardson this week. I finally decided that I couldn't take the perpetual poor performances and gaffes in the debate. Man I thought he was better than that.
I don't know where I go to now. Obama? Maybe. Hillary??? She's been the most impressive to me, in terms of her conduct on the campaign. For now I'm a free agent.
You like Liz Edwards, and I like Hillary's husband. Really like that guy.
skymutt: accept no substitutes!
The worst form of agony
is false hope.
Never loved Richardson, liked by not loved. Never liked Edwards.
I confess to being a big time Obama girl. His temperment is steady and smooth. I really really would LOVE to see him get the nomination. Take the risk.
Hillary, I confess looks good, and with her you do get Ambassador Clinton. The world would cheer loudly for that.
I would pick any dem over any republican.
I'm only half stupid
Pastor Dan from dKos in the NYT
Pastor Dan gets a write in the NYT
Way cool.
My favorite line in the article.
I'm only half stupid
nope
You misread the intent. The netroots are at the center. (My diary here
) especially as contrasted with the DLC.