Friday Open Thread
Is this race-baiting piece of sh*t ever going to stop terrorizing our country? If there is any justice in our country, that ass will get it in spades.
Have a great Friday guys. What are you all up to? Good debate yesterday about sending humans to Mars. Kudos to Tlaloc and Stinerman.
Submitted by Ender on Fri, 2008-01-11 09:47
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Giuliani wants to balance the tax cuts he proposes
with even MORE tax cuts
. Yea, I just saw this @ C&L and here's the Reuters link they provided (for those of you who won't go to C&L...too bad too, they're one of the funniest serious liberal sites out there).
I am a fiscal conservative. I do want to balance out our budget and I don't want to hand my kids (& future grandkids) my own generations debt. I just don't believe this is the way to do it.
Banks Singing the Blues
Following the Rules While Shoveling Cash
Keeping records is such an awful burden for the banking business.
Lots more time bombs expected to go off as '08 progresses into it's eleventh day.
Bank of America Buys Countrywide Financial for a Whisper
This is a write down without a write down, essentially assessing the value of Countrywide the once enormously 'profitable' financial institution is worth only 4 Billion.
It is the economy, stupid.
snow falling in Baghdad
Iraqi capital wakes up to first snowfall in memory
"To discuss evil in a manner implying neutrality, is to sanction it." AR
That is very nice
A few minutes of wonder can do a lot for the soul
"Perplexity is the beginning of knowledge" -- Kahlil Gibran
Rev. Al picketing the Golf Channel
would be pretty ridiculous looking.
But I guess he hasn't been on TV for a while.
qui tacet consentire
There seems to be a lot of race baiting going around
I just wrote a diary this morning about the race-baiters circling Hillary
. And my previous diary a couple days ago was about roughly the same subject.
Most of this stuff that people are getting all up in arms about amounts to absolutely nothing, if you look at each speaker's intent. The golf channel thing is particularly ridiculous. Tiger's not offended, is saying it's a non-issue, says that Tilghman didn't mean anything by the remark, and that should be the end of that.
skymutt: wise and powerful... enlightened...
If only it were so simple
unfortunately in politics, it's never so simple. People like Sharpton have an incentive to make mountains out of flat land when it comes to race.
i agree! It's ridiculous
There are much bigger things to worry about, besides what Al Sharpton is up to today.
I am much more concerned about the economy.
It is the economy, stupid.
Which football games are gonna be played this
weekend?
I'm going out on a limb and saying New England is going all the way.
Meh
I lost interest in this year's NFL season after my fantasy football league was finished for the year. I'm much more invested in following the college version of the sport.
I'll be rooting for the NFC as I always do in the Super Bowl, but I doubt that they're gonna play New England. Jacksonville or Indianapolis is much more likely, IMO.
I never broke the law; I am the law! --
George W. BushJudge DreddI'm listening to...
Kucinich asks for recount in N.H.
http://unionleader.com/article.aspx?headline=Kucinich+says+he%27ll+ask+f...
I mentioned this yesterday.... there was a huge discrepency between the machine-counted precincts and the hand-counted precincts.
In machine-counted precincts, Clinton won by 5%. In hand-counted precincts, Obama won by 4%.
This has "diebold" written all over it.
Good for Kucinich, who has nothing to gain from this.
Obama can't touch this, or he comes off looking like a "whiner".
There were shenanigans going on in N.H. Exit polls are NEVER that far off... 8pm Tuesday the exit polls showed Obama with a 39-34 win....
This is just fishy.... Diebold is owned by a huge GOP supporter... and the GOP definitely wants Hillary as the Dem nominee.
“Unthinking respect for authority is the greatest enemy of truth.” --- Albert Einstein
What's kind of scary is
We Know the GOP wants Hillary to run, but who would a thunk that it is so they can vote for her and not run against her!
It is the economy, stupid.
Dennis can have a recount
If Dennis is willing to pay for the recount.
Yep. There must have been fraud. It couldn't possibly be because more people voted for Hillary.
Somehow Diebold got in there and fixed each one of those machines that are not networked and then went in there and altered all the hand-marked ballots read by optical scanners.
Such diabolical bastards!
qui tacet consentire
Off the mark
Well, Diebold can fix each one of their machines by definition as they are "their" machines.
Altering the ballots is inconsequential if you alter the machine that counts them.
As I just said, I don't believe there was any wrong doing. Probably just a coincidence that optical scanners were used in areas where Hillary had high support.
I never broke the law; I am the law! --
George W. BushJudge DreddI'm listening to...
I vote on an optical scanner
I mark a paper ballot that is fed into a machine that reads it. If I vote for Obama and the machine changes that to Clinton, it would be detectable in an audit unless the ballot I marked is also altered.
qui tacet consentire
Uh, isn't that exactly what Kucinich is asking for?
Maybe I misunderstand you here, but it sounds like you are saying fraud isn't an issue because a hand recount of the pages would catch the discrepancy. I'm sure you are right but that really isn't an argument against doing a hand recount of the pages...
As a side note- this is probably way off base but is it possible Kucinich is angling for a cabinet position in Obama's potential government?
I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.
Hand recount is fine with me
Obama could ask for one and only pay a $2,000 fee. Kucinich has to pay the full cost.
Link
qui tacet consentire
We really should have an automatice recount of any race
where the margin is less than half the number of votes registered on diebold machines.
I see where you are coming from now, Quaoar. Your initial comment about "he should pay for it" sounded spiteful, when really it was just quoting the relevant law.
I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.
And an audit of EVERY race
Mark ballots in a human and computer readable fashion (i.e. go with the touch screen, have it print the actual vote and fill in the bubble for the optical scanner)
Then you feed all ballots into the scanner. Then you audit the human readable ones to make sure they match the results and percent returns from both the touch screen recordings and the scanner.
Size of audit depends on how close the race is, but needs to be sufficient to match the percentages within a very small margin of error.
Easy as can be.
Auditing every race would be too expensive
And unnecessary because not all races are close.
A beter solution would be to randomly pick a certain number of precincts each election to be audited. If someone wanted to cheat, they wouldn't know which precicnts were going to be audited.
qui tacet consentire
I could get behind that...
...if we also demand voters show ID to vote!
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777
What does Vote Counting have to do with Voter ID?
Is there a reason to trade one off against the other? We can improve vote counting security pretty easily. Why hold off on that while we deal with authentication issues?
You want voting to require ID then you need to define a process by which the many elderly (and often minority) citizens are able to get an ID if they don't already have one. That includes those who don't have a vehicle and live in rural areas. And of course, ID evaluation has to be 100% objective and accurate; no "This ID looks fake" issues.
Otherwise, this obstacle to their continuing to vote looks less like a bug and more like a feature.
Giving people tamper-proof ID, like any authorization/authentication process is a very complicated process (people still use fake IDs all the time), but if you have a solution let's hear it.
A process already exists
It's a question of whether they choose to follow it.
If they don't follow it because they're too lazy to bother... too frickin' bad.
If they don't follow it because they "can't afford" to pay the usually nominal fee (my Texas DL costs me less than $5/year), my first response is "BS, they probably *can* afford it, or could if they managed their money more responsibly." In the very rare cases where someone really *cannot* afford it, sure, I'd let them get one for free. And guess what? The Indiana law before the Supreme Court allows them to do exactly this.
And if they don't follow it because they can't provide documentation of their identity, residence, and citizenship, why in the heck would we let them *register* to vote, much less vote, voter ID laws or otherwise? If you can't prove identity, residence, and citizenship, no way should you be allowed anywhere near the voter booth.
Why the hell should you care?
You always insist that voting is meaningless
, so why should you care? The impact of someone without ID voting fraudulently is zero right?
1 vote meaningless; hundreds/thousands/...
A photo ID requirement has no impact on me, since I already have a photo ID.
It may, however, have an impact on other people, perhaps on thousands of other people. If it affects just 1% of registered voters, that *could* very well swing some elections. If that 1% happens to be disproportionately poor, then all the better, since their votes were likely to have been disproportionately Democratic.
Recall, I'm in favor of just about anything that reduces turnout. Anything that reduces turnout increases my share of the vote. Further, recall that I support "one dollar, one vote" -- one dollar taxes paid, one vote. Poor people pay little to nothing in federal taxes (many have a net negative tax liability), and I am *definitely* in favor of disenfranchising anyone who doesn't pay a dime in taxes.
Forum rules prevent me from saying what I really think
Some days I think, "You know, that lordzorgon is misguided, but overall a pretty good guy."
Today wasn't one of them.
If you come to get my vote, be sure to come properly armed. I'm guaranteed a republican form of government by the Constitution and I'll fight to the death to be sure I have it.
I never broke the law; I am the law! --
George W. BushJudge DreddI'm listening to...
With that attitude
You'd do well in a place like Zimbabwe.
qui tacet consentire
Is there a reason to trade one off against the other...
...not per se but if we are going to reform lets do it all the way!
the problem with fixing or improving or insuring accuracy for vote counting is moot until we know exactly who's voting in the first place!!! This would mean the Democrats couldn't continue having dead people, dogs, and felons vote anymore but hey, if we're going to be up in arms about the count lets make sure everything is accurate.
as to your elderly -- poor -- minority straw-man argument the left trouts out every time this issue is raised the answer is simple... we do as Georgia does and require states to provide rides for those who cannot afford to get to an issuing place and send people out to those who are immobile. this system works great in Georgia and will work equally as well in all others.
As to this:
Id use MBNA
which has been issuing nearly tamper-proof credit and ATM bank cards for decades (Id also use this company for Real ID and or temporary worker type cards for our immigration reform)
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777
Voter ID is easy to solve
When you register to vote they give you a photo ID. If you want an absentee ballot you can call the courthouse and give your ID number. You also have same day registration so you can show up on election day and register to vote and then vote as long as you bring the required proof.
qui tacet consentire
It would seem...
...we agree then.
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777
Auditing every race doesn't necessarily mean every precinct
Unless you have precinct specific races. Just as you don't have to recount every vote to be an audit of the race, you don't need to do every precinct.
I just don't want to make it OK to cheat as long as you cheat big.
And..
They don't automatically audit them. They just run the count through the machines and then merge the results.
That's the problem with less-than-x% recount laws. If you steal the election by enough, there is no reason to request an audit.
I never broke the law; I am the law! --
George W. BushJudge DreddI'm listening to...
I doubt it
I'm very, very leery of voting machines, but I think this isn't going to uncover anything.
I'd look at which counties used machine counts and then see if they are geographically correlated. It makes sense that different candidates would appeal differently to certain areas.
Every count should be by hand. Somehow almost every other country can do them by hand and have the results by the next morning.
I never broke the law; I am the law! --
George W. BushJudge DreddI'm listening to...
the race hustlers
are now attacking Andrew Cuomo - AG of NY State, for using the phrase "shuck and jive".
That's the Left. Destroying people for imagined thoughtcrime.
"To discuss evil in a manner implying neutrality, is to sanction it." AR
how nauseating.
did you read the diary? and some the comments?
wow.
This exchange
was my favorite:
Link
I haven't decided whether to TR it.
qui tacet consentire
yeah I read enough :)
some crazy crazy stuff. And this is not the only diary on the topic. Read this recommended idiocy
by moron kath25.
Her premise is explained in the first paragraph, clarifying that because "shuck and jive" is attributed to "US Blacks" in Oxford English Dictionary, it is automatically racist.
She is a blithering dolt who will one day make a great political operative.
"To discuss evil in a manner implying neutrality, is to sanction it." AR
The rec list at DKos
has become a toxic waste dump of candidate diaries igniting flame wars.
The primaries can't end soon enough.
qui tacet consentire
I am mildly offended
...that my diary on the subject did not get recced up like all these other ones :-)
And mine actually had a point and everything!
skymutt: wise and powerful... enlightened...
yeah, I noticed :)
I guess not controversial enough...
"To discuss evil in a manner implying neutrality, is to sanction it." AR
He should have written about Obama.
Perhaps skymutt should have written a diary explaining that he dislikes Obama because he feels that the candidate is not niggardly enough to tackle the upcoming budget crunch. Alan Keyes on the other hand...
That'd get some recs.
I never broke the law; I am the law! --
George W. BushJudge DreddI'm listening to...
I agree
that would be good :)
"To discuss evil in a manner implying neutrality, is to sanction it." AR
You weren't ramped up precicely because
you weren't offensive enough to "the enemies".
Sometimes DKos is just way too much groupthink for me.
Allow yourself to think for yourself.
wow again...
just when I thought it couldn't get worse.
A dolt she is. (I love that word, btw...one of my favorites)
There's also dimwit, nitwit, twit and just plain ol' dim. They all work. :)
I'm also starting to like "thtoopit" lol.
I like the dimwit as well :)
There is just too much stupidity in those diaries... Now, I don't read much of the GOP squabbling anymore but at least they didn't have this complete and utter childishness.
"To discuss evil in a manner implying neutrality, is to sanction it." AR
Shuck and jive is one of those phrases
that should probably be retired. It does refer to how some blacks used to communicate with some whites, but it is hardly akin to the N word and it is certainly nothing to march in the streets about.
qui tacet consentire
of course
the overreactions that are happening between these two campaigns are amazing.
"To discuss evil in a manner implying neutrality, is to sanction it." AR
PC wars are heating up again
are we going to have a rehash of our last big fight over PC?
(I personally find the PC mentality to be the worst manifestation of the left)
I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.
the PW III is right around the corner
if I say "Hillary used an Iron". I think I will refrain.
"To discuss evil in a manner implying neutrality, is to sanction it." AR
The Mac is waaaaaay better
Than the PC.
PC U53r5 5Uck!1!1
Your mouth would make a perfect urinal*
*a line from"blood sucking freaks" and no I don't recommend the movie.
I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.
PC users are into the weirdest things
Degenerates, the lot of you! Go find some other Windows Freak to play your water sports with, I hear that's a common desire among your kind!
Here: Reasons to upgrade from Vista to XP
. (Oh, just put your little pointy arrow thing over the text with the different color and push the button on your mouse (not ACTUALLY a mouse) to read the article. If you have trouble, call 9-1-1)
:-)
that was funny
I still would like to try Vista out someday :) Just to see what I skipped over on my way to XP Pro.
"To discuss evil in a manner implying neutrality, is to sanction it." AR
One. Button. mouse.
For those people who want to use a computer but find numbers 2 and up confusing.
I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.
Multi. Touch. Pad.
For people who don't find entertainment in clicking noises.
Yeah, I'm a nerd
I guess I'm the only Linux user here.
I never broke the law; I am the law! --
George W. BushJudge DreddI'm listening to...
I would go Linux
but I like computer games. Everyone I've talked to who uses Linux and games sets up a dual boot system to run windows when they game. It's not worth the hassle to me, personally.
The best explanation I've every heard about the differences between macs and PCs is to liken them to cars. Macs are automatic transmissions. They work, their easy to operate but you have much less control over how they work, and because of that they end up less efficient in the hands of someone competent, but much better for those who don;t know what they are doing. PCs are the manual transmissions- kind of a pain to learn to work it but by the time you do you *know* how your computer works, because you've been elbow deep in the guts of it cursing and sputtering.
I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.
I spend all day with my hands in the grease
We use ESX server running virtualized windows and linux, as well as Windows boxes running VM Workstation. I get my hands greasy in the internals of host and network configurations (though I tend to stay away from the BIOS)
It is because of this that I don't like the way windows works (or doesn't work) with the underlying command line operating system.
Mac just integrated their gui with the underlying UNIX better.
stinerman is right. You want to get into the nuts and bolts, use Linux.
And you are right, if you want to play games, use Windows, that's what it is good for.
Dual-booting isn't that big of a deal
I don't play enough games to make it much of a problem to go sans Microsoft. I do have an XP partition, but I haven't booted into it in over 3 months.
There are lots of interesting games for Linux-based OSes. I play OpenArena, Battle for Wesnoth, and a few others somewhat regularly. Wine is very hit or miss on Windows-only games. Cedega is a pay version of Wine that is supposed to be better in terms of compatibility, but I've heard that regular Wine is catching up.
I never broke the law; I am the law! --
George W. BushJudge DreddI'm listening to...
I got a Mac for Christmas
:)
qui tacet consentire
Welcome to the light side! n/t
Shows how much I know
I thought it had to do something with boxing.
I never broke the law; I am the law! --
George W. BushJudge DreddI'm listening to...
the race-baiting is only going to increase in the Dem Party
When you have a party that has thrived by playing the identity politics against its opponents, it should come as no surprise that those guns are easily trained at its own members.
Since the immediate coronation of Senator Obama has not succeeded in its aftermath his supporters are angrily utilizing the tried and true race-baiting techniques.
Of course Clinton supporters are utilizing the gender card in retaliation and so far the Clinton block has the upper hand.
It is only expected when two blocks, used to utilizing their superficial characteristics to their advantage, collide. Have fun! Maybe throw in Sharpton and Jackson and Steinem for good measure.
"To discuss evil in a manner implying neutrality, is to sanction it." AR
On the other hand--
--the Democrats have managed to have serious candidates who are not white males. That ought to tell you something. Yeah it gets messy and ugly at times, and some Dems go off the deep end somethimes, but that's life. Most of the positive social breakthroughs have been made by Democrats because we are willing to put up with some of the nonsense and turmoil in the short term with the knowledge that reason and sanity usually wins out in the long term.
skymutt: wise and powerful... enlightened...
the only reason those 2 people
are serious candidates is precisely because they are not white males. That ought to tell you something. Dem party is excited over two candidates because they are not white males and not because they are qualified.
Mind you I am not saying that GOP candidates are great. But the "great" Dem field is a bunch of pathetically empty speechifiers who are ahead because of external characteristics and propelled by identity politics.
"To discuss evil in a manner implying neutrality, is to sanction it." AR
Oh come on...
are you really going to argue that Hillary is not a consummate politician?
Or that Obama does not have serious charisma?
You may be right that either or both is unqualified, but you can't say that their qualifications are noticeably sub-par compared to people who have been elected in recent times.
I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.
you are probably right on
But I think if Hillary and Obama were white men, they would be nowhere near the lead. Obama is the worst with barely any time in the senate and not much beyond preaching about "hope". Hillary's biggest accomplishment was being the First Lady which propelled her pathetically short Senate career.
Now, to be fair, Edwards is just as unqualified. But all this just shows that the Dem side is only superficially (popularity and novelty related) qualified.
"To discuss evil in a manner implying neutrality, is to sanction it." AR
Yes the Republican candidates are so above it all
such very serious people! The Aristocrats of the politicians.
They have Reaganed the country to death and we have all been Cheneyed!
When David Frum of NRO/AEI/NEO-CON fame, and a very serious person starts saying that Reagan's era has passed, it might be time to reassess Reagan's sainthood.
Especially in light of the failing Middle Class Red Neck's who used to vote Republican. They are buying into Mike Huckabee's, very unserious message like gangbusters.
It is the economy, stupid.
And Romney would likely be your nominee
If he wasn't Mormon. That ought to tell you something.
qui tacet consentire
I guess it depends on your point of view
I think the dem candidates all look fantastic. They sound great. They are smart.
You're just jealous. Admit it.
It is the economy, stupid.
No, they are both qualified
It's not about years of service. It's about whether you can think on your feet. It's about an ability to stay cool under pressure. It's about whether you can attract a good team. It's about whether you can inspire. I think both of them can do the job.
I have talked before about the importance of image in a President. A good speechifier is precisely what you need in a President, not a micromanager! Look at Reagan. He was a speechifier, not a nuts and bolts guy, and yet he was effective. FDR was a speechifier, not a policy wonk. Kennedy was a speechifier and used his image to his advantage.
On the other hand, let's look at the "most qualified" presidents we've had-- the ones with the most applicable experience in government. There, you have Bush 41, Nixon, LBJ. These guys were not effective presidents. They had the qualifications on paper but they couldn't inspire the masses.
The responsibilities of the Presidency are so big that I don't think you have a very good chance of being effective unless you get the masses to buy into your vision. That's where image comes in. If you have that star image, people want to be identified with you, and will work hard for your agenda just for the possibility of catching some of your reflected light.
Obama himself is not propelled by identity politics-- that's a bogus charge. Sure, he has some supporters who are trying to play the race card, but Obama hasn't stooped to that level. Likewise, Hillary has not played the "female" card. Okay, maybe she's taken the female card out of the deck and flashed it a couple of times ;-)
skymutt: wise and powerful... enlightened...
Does the Nevada 1/19 caucus diss observant jews?
According to Wonkette
the time and date (a Saturday @ 9 & 11:30) are times when observant jews are supposed to be in temple.
I guess neither party gave much thought to that base. Was it callous or just an oversite? Or did they really not care?
Holy Moses
Of course they care. I am sure it was just an oversight.
Please don't to get paranoid about anti-semitism!!! These guys
want every vote they can get!
It is the economy, stupid.
Between christians, muslims, and jews
you have a day of rest on friday, saturday, and sunday.
Kind of makes things hard. :)
I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.
Mon-Fri. tough for the working crowd
Maybe they can change it to Sat afternoon.
It is the economy, stupid.
The Sabbath?
That leaves out Jews and Seventh Day Adventists.
Make it Saturday evening, after sunset.
Oy! Goya
I didn't know!
It is the economy, stupid.
Controversial DOJ Voting Section Deps Get Demoted
Remember John Tanner?
He's the guy who said old minorities don't matter because they die first. He was fired last month & his replacement (via TPM):
"Christopher Coates, a veteran of the section, demoted Tanner's controversial deputy chiefs, Susana Lorenzo-Giguere and Yvette Rivera. The changes were announced in an email to voting section staff.
The Justice Department's Office of Professional Responsibility is investigating whether Lorenzo-Giguere had filed certain lawsuits in order to get paid while living at her Cape Cod beach house. Tanner was under investigating for approving the arrangement. Both were accused by former section lawyers in complaints to OPR and the inspector general of seeking reimbursement for official travel.
Rivera has been accused of discriminating against African-American employees. She oversaw the important Section Five unit, which has the responsibility of reviewing election laws in parts of the country with a history of discrimination. Encouragingly, her replacement is Tim Mellett, one of the staff attorneys who in 2003, found that Tom DeLay's Texas redistricting plan violated the Voting Rights Act, a finding that was overruled by political appointees."
It sort of seems to me that
Al Sharpton is always there to exploit given situations and blow them out of proportion, making things even worse by addng fuel to the fire, so to speak. Maybe the country needs to be somewhat shaken and aware of racism, but that's not the way to do it. Without knowing the full story, Kelly Tilghman's remark sounded inappropriate and deserved reprimand and some type of punishment, which she got (a two week suspension from her job as TV Broadcaster). Kelly Tighlman got a two-week suspension, and she apologized for the remark. and that was that. Sharpton should learn when to stop.
Regarding the weekend: Happy New Year to everybody here on Swordscrossed. This weekend has been relatively uneventful so far. After a spate of nice weather, we're supposed to get a large snowstorm late Sunday night, around midnight, and into Monday. Oh, well. Welcome to New England.