On Free Exchange in Trade

This one will be rather short (well maybe not), but I was thinking about this more and more recently and wanted to get my thoughts down on some electrons while the idea was fresh.

When talking about economic transactions, one often hears the story of the two gentlemen who, without any coercion on either's part, come to an agreement.  The buyer agrees to pay $X for a widget sold by the seller. Both men are ostensibly "better off" for the deal, which becomes a point for increasing free trade.

I suppose that both men are "better off" from their own point of view, but what about from an objective point of view?  Is there even a way to objectively measure this?  I'm bold enough to say there is!

Using a continuum, we can "visualize" the price at which a buyer would buy a good or service and at which the seller would provide the good or service.  So long as their pricelines match somewhere, they will come to an agreement.  I'll switch terminology and say that both are equally "worse off" if the area of overlap on the priceline is bisected; at this bisection is the objective "worse off" point.  This would be the point at which neither person is, comparatively speaking, better/worse off than the other.

I'll also talk a bit about fairness here, too.  This point of objectivity is also the most fair price point at which a good or service could be sold.  Being that I'm still a philosophical liberal, I enjoy government intervention on behalf of whomever is getting the more raw deal.  Nine times out of ten the seller, because he has a greater reserve of capital, can afford to be more discriminating than the buyer, which is why I support any government efforts (done within constitutional parameters, mind you) to level the playing field as it were.

Now this is under complete information assumptions.  Under incomplete information assumptions a different definition of "objective" occurs.  The "you paid WHAT for that?" is the very trival (and fuzzy) benchmark for objectivity there.  Veblen comes to mind as well when thinking about objectivity.

What say you?

 

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I'd say I feel like I just

I'd say I feel like I just got done watching A Beautiful Mind and guage your reaction to see if you caught my reference and subsequently my unspoken sub-reference.

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It was a horrible movie

But I do enjoy game theory as much as the next guy with a B.S. in Mathematics...

I never broke the law; I am the law! -- George W. Bush Judge Dredd
I'm listening to...

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Or an MBA...

;-)

Underlying all arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. ~M. Friedman

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Prices are generally determined by markets...

...or to be more precise, the aggregate activity of all buyers and sellers in a market.  If there's more than one buyer and/or more than one seller in a market (the usual case), then it seems that your model for determining fair prices breaks down. 

Embrace the yin and yang of supply & demand, man!  There's nothing fairer than a well-operating market for determining 'fair' prices.  No government 'levelling of the playing field' necessary.

 

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And so it begins....once again.

I suppose that both men are "better off" from their own point of view, but what about from an objective point of view?  Is there even a way to objectively measure this?  I'm bold enough to say there is!

Of course you do! As have many before you.

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expectation as determinant of value

So long as their pricelines match somewhere, they will come to an agreement.  I'll switch terminology and say that both are equally "worse off" if the area of overlap on the priceline is bisected; at this bisection is the objective "worse off" point.  This would be the point at which neither person is, comparatively speaking, better/worse off than the other.

If I've got this right, you're saying that if the seller is willing to sell for $50 and the buyer is willing to buy for $100, then they should reach a deal and the fair price is $75. Right?

My first problem with this model is that you said that we are assuming perfect information, but you didn't seem to consider how this impacts the prices demanded by participants in a market. In a functioning market, the seller should be willing to sell for no less than whatever price he thinks "the next buyer" is willing to buy for. Likewise, the buyer should be willing to buy for no more than what he thinks "the next seller" is willing to sell for. Sorta like a Vickrey auction .

In this case, with perfect information and a fluid market, both "the next buyer" and "the next seller" are basically the market price. So if the buyer and seller make a deal, there should be no ambiguity in the price and no way for one or the other of them to get the better deal.

I think you have interesting situations if the actors have imperfect information, or the market doesn't work well (e.g. small community or monopsony).

Some of your description inspired the following model of an actor with poor information:

  • The actor does not have a clear idea of what the market price is.
  • The cost of postponing the transaction is high (ideas of objective/non-market value might come into play here), so the actor is willing to error on the side of getting a worse deal just to make sure he gets some deal.

As you suggested, many transactions are asymmetrical. Consider a situation with a "big guy" (BG) who engages in high-volume market transactions and a "small guy" (SG) who engages in rare/small market transactions. For instance, BG may be a large employer and SG is one of his employees. Conversely, BG may be a retail outlet, while SG is one of their customers.

BG will typically have more information about the market, both because he has gathered this information in each of his transactions and because it is worthwhile for him to do market research. Conversely, SG may be pretty clueless. In this case, I'd expect SG to typically get the raw deal (i.e. the price will deviate from the perfect market price in a way that favors BG).

Furthermore, if SG is both uninformed and impoverished, he may take whatever deal BG offers simply so that he can quickly get some item that he urgently needs.

This model has plenty of implications, and I can only scratch the surface here:

  • financial success may result from a person's ability to manipulate this dynamic (as opposed to being ameasure fo their contribution to society). It is good to have better information, better bargaining position, and to manipulate the other person's uncertainty (e.g. by spreading misinformation and appealing to emotion, among other underhanded but common marketing strategies)
  • equality (and market efficiency) may be promoted by providing "the small guy" with better market information, or by addressing his anxiety about not failing to complete his transaction immediately.

Even if you consider the above issues to be in need of action, there are myriad strategies to address them. I'm not convinced that state regulation would be particularly effective. I am especially unconvinced that political activism (campaigning and lobbying) would be more effective than attempts to directly address these problems.

In my expert opinion, you should do what I tell you to do.

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I appreciate your comment

I think you put more thought into it than I did my post!

I was actually just talking completely theoretically here.  I didn't expect anyone to dissect it as such.  This was just another idea I had bouncing around in the noggin, but wanted to get down on "paper".  And then the SC faithful could take potshots at it.

As they say, "In theory, theory and practice are the same, but in practice they aren't."

I never broke the law; I am the law! -- George W. Bush Judge Dredd
I'm listening to...

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I think you're on to something

I think you put more thought into it than I did my post!

I bothered because I think you're hitting on an important issue. The ideas are worth developing more. There has probably been a lot of good stuff written on this issue.

In my expert opinion, you should do what I tell you to do.

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Liberals and Economics Go Together Like...

...Ok They Don't Go Together.

According to the SF Chronical ,

It is too easy to make fun of the people who packed Room 400 in San Francisco's City Hall to stop American Apparel from opening a store on Valencia Street in the Mission District last week.

But let's make fun of them anyway — and everyone of their kind. It's the least we can do to repay them for making it impossible to do business in this country. Even the Chronical is appalled:

They are not serious people. They live in a world where facts like 27 vacant storefronts on Valencia Street and 9.3 percent unemployment statewide and nearly 600,000 jobs lost nationally last month do not matter. The few who read books know no authors beyond Naomi Klein. They do not believe that the world has changed since the 1999 World Trade Organization protests in Seattle. This accounts for both the static nature of their vocabulary — "no formula retail!" is their death chant, though anyone who has picked up a newspaper in the last five months could tell you that there isn't a single retail establishment with a formula today — and the juvenile nature of their worldview. They do not want to see businesses be successful.

American Apparel pays immigrant labor over twice minimum wage to make clothes in Los Angeles. But it constitutes a chain store, so moonbats want it banned. They regard it as a "parasite" on their rotting urban "ecosystem." Those who would defend the capitalist exploiters received no quarter from SF's righteous liberals:

When a young man stood before the board and said that he only had health care because of his job at American Apparel, a voice in the overflow room called, "Get a job somewhere else!" Another employee told a story about a young Latino man who was able to send money to his family in Central America, and this news was met with sneers. An American Apparel representative told the board that he had gotten messages from people threatening to throw a brick through the store window, and the crowd laughed.

Don't bother asking liberals who they are going to tax if no one's allowed to run a business. They'll just tell you "the rich" have plenty of money.

 

Underlying all arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. ~M. Friedman

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If people want to protest a chain store

what's the problem?  Prefering local companies to franchises is not economically ignorant, nor is it anti-business. It is anti-big business, which is itself pretty darn rational.

I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.

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Besides me, I think the...

Owners of the empty storefronts....

Residents of the Sate of CA who send unemployment checks...

Local individuals who could have jobs there...

The city and county who could collect the taxes...

The kids who's parents could be employed...

The many, many vendors of that and other companies that could fill those storefronts...

The businesses that could service those businesses...

Etc. etc, etc....

.....would sure disagree with your hip, bohemian business sensibilities!

 

 

Underlying all arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. ~M. Friedman

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Ok

What that has to do with my diary, I don't know.

I never broke the law; I am the law! -- George W. Bush Judge Dredd
I'm listening to...

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Move it Stiner...

..I meant it to go in Nosatgianomics...

Sorry.

Then can you just delete this post...

 

Thanks!

 

Underlying all arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. ~M. Friedman

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I don't have that much power

I can delete, but I can't add under your name**.  If you add an entry where you want the comment to be, I can copy and paste your words there.

In either case, I won't delete anything here because no harm was done.

I only exercise deletion authority for obvious double posts or if we have a spammer on our hands.\

 

**In fact only Ender has that power these days (since Brendan is on hiatus), and he isn't around so much anymore.

I never broke the law; I am the law! -- George W. Bush Judge Dredd
I'm listening to...

………… parent